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Troll wall is illegal
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Dunny

Jul 29, 2019, 1:56 PM
Post #1 of 25 (7106 views)
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Troll wall is illegal Can't Post

Troll wall is illegal. People posting evidence of troll wall jumping online will be prosecuted. This is not my law and i am a little tired of being attacked for hassling people to take their evidence down. Posting troll evidence is making it harder for locals to continue the hospitality. Dont be that guy. Please do not post troll evidence.

Dunny

Jul 29, 2019, 2:54 PM
Post #2 of 25 (7077 views)
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Re: [Dunny] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

Ludvig Felix Lorentzen:" I can confirm that the fine is at 30000 ???????? Got shocked when I opened the mail... We are worse than rapist these days..."

climbing.simon

Jul 30, 2019, 12:27 AM
Post #3 of 25 (7011 views)
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Re: [Dunny] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

Last year, when going for a hike there we were harassed by a hiker that turned out to be a cop. He was very clear that he didnt like the thought that we might be jumping and made it very clear it was illegal. I'm not saying dont jump it, just be smart as per all illegal jumps!

Meat.Missile

Jul 30, 2019, 12:54 AM
Post #4 of 25 (7003 views)
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Re: [Dunny] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

Dunny wrote:
Troll wall is illegal. People posting evidence of troll wall jumping online will be prosecuted. This is not my law and i am a little tired of being attacked for hassling people to take their evidence down. Posting troll evidence is making it harder for locals to continue the hospitality. Dont be that guy. Please do not post troll evidence.

for us not in the know, how come it's illegal?

Fledgling

Jul 30, 2019, 3:57 AM
Post #5 of 25 (6979 views)
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Re: [Meat.Missile] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

For the safety of rescue personnel.

Heat

Jul 30, 2019, 4:48 AM
Post #6 of 25 (6970 views)
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Re: [Dunny] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

The is also an ongoing rescue mission for two (presumed dead) climbers in Troll Wall right now. DO NOT JUMP THERE. Ther operation is big, includes rescue helicopters, police on the ground and local climbers.

Dunny

Jul 30, 2019, 2:44 PM
Post #7 of 25 (6859 views)
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Re: [Meat.Missile] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

for us not in the know, how come it's illegal?

The rock formation at Troll wall is very unstable, rocks are falling constantly so heli rescue is very unsafe for heli crew. This puts the mountain rescue team in a very dangerous situation. There is currently a body recovery in place for 2 dead climbers. This could be a 3 day mission for the mountain rescue team. Part of the rescue team are jumpers. Please show respect by not posting evidence. it should be simple to understand.

AntoineLaporte

Jul 31, 2019, 7:24 AM
Post #8 of 25 (6763 views)
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Re: [Dunny] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

After the Squirrel and RedBull videos and nobody complaining about them it's easy to understand that people can be confused.
It was already illegal and 2 big companies don't does, at some point I was the first to think "why should I ?"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uyvl9fASAo
https://www.redbull.com/...ows/AP-1X2R1CB791W11
https://vimeo.com/232367489

I think this could be a good start by asking first these guys to remove their vids before asking the guys with less than 500 views on their video...
I already said it, I'm pointing it again, they are not above the laws unless they can provide the special permission they got for it, which doesn't exists for sure at least for one, and apparently also for the other.

TomAiello

Jul 31, 2019, 7:37 AM
Post #9 of 25 (6759 views)
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Re: [AntoineLaporte] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

That's an excellent point, actually.

We also have to remember that "marketing" and "leading" are two different things.

Groups that are in the business of marketing products don't always make the best decisions for a larger group, long term. That's not their job. Their job is to make bigger marketing splash for their product, and sell more stuff.

Especially in the internet era, people tend to confuse awesome marketing videos with good role models. That's largely our own faults--I've seen people emulate marketing videos that had text printed across them with messages like "this is a bad idea--don't ever do this".

A little reflection on which examples to follow might not be a bad idea for any of us.


(This post was edited by TomAiello on Jul 31, 2019, 7:38 AM)

AntoineLaporte

Jul 31, 2019, 10:34 AM
Post #10 of 25 (6717 views)
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Re: [TomAiello] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

I understand what you are saying Tom.
But even if marketing has not the role of leading, it has at least to follow the rules, and obviously the laws.
Also if the leaders are not saying that marketing is wrong by not doing that, they are not good leaders.

I personnaly put some videos of the troll wall, and I will not remove them until the video I linked are removed with the why.
Now if some people have something to say to me I'd like them to come public with their complain to the people involved in the videos linked as they would do with me.

I know it's not the good way to lead but in this case I already tried to tell people that putting videos of Troll wall was not the best idea to get it legal again, and everybody just said that I was or jealous or just a Squirrel hater.
The Redbull video happends after, and nobody put a word against it.
And now people are suprised that random basejumpers are putting their videos out too ? Really ?

So now for me it is: clean your backyard beafore asking me to clean mine, which is same as lead by example I think.

Heat

Aug 2, 2019, 12:16 AM
Post #11 of 25 (6540 views)
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Re: [AntoineLaporte] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

AntoineLaporte wrote:
So now for me it is: clean your backyard beafore asking me to clean mine, which is same as lead by example I think.

If that is the case you choose to be part of the problem, not the solution. Basejumpers and their egos... Two wrongs don't make a right.

AntoineLaporte

Aug 2, 2019, 12:42 AM
Post #12 of 25 (6530 views)
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Re: [Heat] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

Heat wrote:
If that is the case you choose to be part of the problem, not the solution. Basejumpers and their egos... Two wrongs don't make a right.

I have guess some IDs here, but not yours.

As I said, I tried one way to be part of the solution before for this videos problem, have you ?
Where are your words about the 2 videos I linked with thousands of view ?
Don't you think that my video called "Stabbeskaret" (252 views) is way less important than a RedBull video with 2 Norvegians called "Wingsuit Flying Off The Troll Wall" (55+K views just on YouTube) ?

No ego here, just being tired to have people only barking to the smalls and never say a word about the bigs, like what you've just done.

Me saying that I will not remove my video makes you react, maybe you will even talk about the others videos to prove me wrong, and this is what I expect to get, and so being part of the solution.
If you and some others are starting to talk about the others videos and have one of the 2 removed I can swear I will delete mine no problem, it is one of many and I don't really care, I got it for me if I want to see it again.
I might be part of the solution at the end, more than you think.

Heat

Aug 2, 2019, 1:33 AM
Post #13 of 25 (6517 views)
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Re: [AntoineLaporte] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

We actually met briefly on landing in 2016 I think. You and Shane jumped from Troll, I just jumped Cold War. I'm Magnus.

The Redbull video has been, and continue to be, discussed by the local community in Romsdalen where I am from and enjoy jumping. Just because I haven't talked about it in this thread does not mean I haven't discussed it. They ended up getting fined for it and I have observed some have bitched about it. That's pathetic, they knew it was illegal and thus should own it like grown men.

You brought up your own videos and that you won't take them down in this thread, which I adressed. It should not be hard to comprehend.

This all ads up, the small and the big. I don't like it when anyone post videos online from the Troll wall, regardless of name and status in the sport. But for some it is obviously a very important part of their jumping and marketing. Too bad enjoying that spectacular jump with friends is not enoughUnsure

hjumper33
Moderator
Aug 2, 2019, 1:58 AM
Post #14 of 25 (6510 views)
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Re: [climbing.simon] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

Yup, some of my favorite local objects fall in this same category. Just respect a few simple rules, and everything will be fine. Hypocrisy and bad ethics arent exactly uncommon in the cutthroat world of “professional BASE jumping”. BASE ethics aren’t exactly complicated or profound. If a local is asking you to do something to help not heat up a technically illegal site, just do it.

AntoineLaporte

Aug 2, 2019, 3:06 AM
Post #15 of 25 (6495 views)
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Re: [Heat] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

I understand your point of view, and discuss about it locally is nice.
But if you want to fight to FB and Youtube videos, you have to fight them on their terrain, YouTube and FB.
You probably did not put any video of the Troll online, and I would respect that.
Did you send a mail to RedBull or Squirrel, did you put a comment on their official page, did you get public with your complain ?
If you cannot answer yes at one of these question why should people follow your example and not their ?

As I said if you and the people put a public complain about these 2 videos I will erase mine in a minute, but not before. I'm tired od being the only one to do it and being just classified as a jaelous person or a hater, and when I do it I would had loved to have the PUBLIC support of the locals.

I will stand on my position for my video and its 252 views until then.
I hope for you that you will get some more video removed.
I jumped it 3 times this year, only one video (without the name of Troll).

Heat

Aug 2, 2019, 3:44 AM
Post #16 of 25 (6489 views)
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Re: [AntoineLaporte] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

I believe this is best adressed jumper to jumper. I might be wrong.

Discussing this public is problematic for many locals who are from the area and/or live there. Often, talking about jumping at this illegal jump is quickly followed up by questions from family, friends, local community, local media and even local police authorities. Romsdalen is a small place and most people know eachother in one way or another.

Public opinion over jumping this wall has shifted back and forth over the years, but the locals have for the most part been stealth and a "live and let live" between authorities and jumpers organically developed. This is a very fragile balance though. Now it seems this has changed, due to the amount of jumps in the wall and people posting on social media. The pendulum is swinging the wrong way and the police has sent a strong message through fining the most public display of jumping, found on Red Bulls youtube channel starring jumpers who should know better.

AntoineLaporte

Aug 2, 2019, 6:40 AM
Post #17 of 25 (6452 views)
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Re: [Heat] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

I understand your point of view.
We got some same kind of thing here in France with the Millau bridge and Chamonix.
I will (and already did) not stay jumper to jumper when videos are posted.

For me having these vids from big companies and famous basejumpers without nothing written that it's illegal makes it legal for all the people who don't know anything about the rules there.

I hope your way of doing it will work, but I'm pretty sure only leading by example (and fees) is working, and example must be public.
For example I did not know that some got a fee for the video, if it was more public I'm sure there would be less videos out.
Fee is nice, having the videos still online is not BTW. If tomorrow a guy get 5000 from a video that stays online and costs him 3000 why would he not do it again ?

Keeping it from jumper to jumper is not the good way IMO.

Good luck with it

TomAiello

Aug 2, 2019, 7:34 AM
Post #18 of 25 (6440 views)
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Re: [hjumper33] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

hjumper33 wrote:
If a local is asking you to do something to help not heat up a technically illegal site, just do it.

That's also true for legal sites.

Look, for example, at Lauterbrunnen, and it's easy to see why it's perhaps more important at the legal sites than the illegal ones. The first time I went there, the most popular exit point was at a place called Staubbachfall.

It's so easy to spend a few extra dollars (within the context of a much more expensive hobby and trip) for landing cards, insurance, etc. And yet it's often very difficult to convince people to do that.

Dunny

Aug 2, 2019, 8:49 AM
Post #19 of 25 (6436 views)
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Re: [AntoineLaporte] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

I have to ask myself What would be the conclusion of this discussion if we changed the name to Charmonix or Yosemite?

Thank you Antione for showing the links. We will continue to get them all down. The 1st high profile guy i asked had no problem at all and his sponsored videos were immedietally removed.

This issue is an ongoing concern for locals. We all agree and will continue to protect the church. The resistance is only very few.

Dunny

Aug 2, 2019, 3:41 PM
Post #20 of 25 (6366 views)
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Re: [Dunny] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

After a 5 day mission the 2 bodies have been removed from troll wall. These were unlucky climbers. Please be aware of the mission you place on the local volunteer mountain rescue team if you are unlucky.

MrAW

Aug 2, 2019, 6:40 PM
Post #21 of 25 (6334 views)
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Re: [Dunny] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

Thank you for all your work, as always.

Dunny

Aug 4, 2019, 10:16 AM
Post #22 of 25 (6138 views)
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https://www.facebook.com/...taAcZ_&__tn__=-R

kleggo

Aug 5, 2019, 2:32 PM
Post #23 of 25 (5937 views)
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Re: [Meat.Missile] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

Meat.Missile wrote:
Dunny wrote:
Troll wall is illegal. People posting evidence of troll wall jumping online will be prosecuted. This is not my law and i am a little tired of being attacked for hassling people to take their evidence down. Posting troll evidence is making it harder for locals to continue the hospitality. Dont be that guy. Please do not post troll evidence.

for us not in the know, how come it's illegal?

The surrounding rock walls are very friable which puts rescue personnel @ significant risk.


(This post was edited by kleggo on Aug 5, 2019, 2:33 PM)

Dunny

Aug 9, 2019, 11:18 AM
Post #24 of 25 (5696 views)
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Re: [Dunny] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

Dunny wrote:
Troll wall is illegal. People posting evidence of troll wall jumping online will be prosecuted. This is not my law and i am a little tired of being attacked for hassling people to take their evidence down. Posting troll evidence is making it harder for locals to continue the hospitality. Dont be that guy. Please do not post troll evidence.

This an article today in Norway national news paper from the police confirming the story including a photo of somebody jumping Troll wall this year.

https://www.dagbladet.no/...R6DzaWRiB-iHWN2_S-No

Please remove any troll evidence. You have been warned.

RickHarrison

Aug 21, 2019, 12:43 AM
Post #25 of 25 (5237 views)
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Re: [Dunny] Troll wall is illegal [In reply to] Can't Post

If you really want to do Troll Spire, then you need to be smart about it. Do your homework and get a guide if you don't know the route. That is a wonderful exit point first discovered by a legendary Norwegian climber who used to be a resistance fighter against the Nazis in WWII. For decades Arnie had been a premier climber in this area and he called a Norwegian friend of my brother Randy and mine, John Mjoen of Alta,Norway and told him "John, you need to see this place". John was Norway BASE 1 and was a veteran of their Delta Force. John met Randy and I first at Bridge Day 83. Came into our room with 2 big Norges looking for the party and we partied big time the entire week. We stayed friends after that until he died taking a German tandem student on a jump in Denmark in 94. Anyway, John's Andalsnes friend, Arnie, had discovered most of the climbing routes up in the mountains back in the 50s and 60s and found the Troll Spire exit point with about 4000' below it before the talus. Before that the Norges and actually the Fins were the first to do cliff jumps on Trollvegan. They found Bruskart (spelling), a cliff on Troll Mtn in a horshoe formation that was jumped quite a bit in the early 80's. I think it took about 8 lives back then. I saw film of a gruesome one when my bro and I did Kjerag in 99 with Thor Alex Koffefiel who died at Kjerag and we did his funeral up north in Moriana. IF you find the correct exit point for Troll Spire, look down, you'll see a ledge that sticks out about 300 feet down, (5 to 6 seconds). Not too big so if you get a decent exit and don't slip you can make it past it. Otherwise, we exited about 40 degrees to the left where we got 12 plus second rock drops back then and stayed stable for the first 6 seconds then as you see the ledge go by at about 75 mph you turn right about 60 degrees and track for another 10 seconds or so and open with at least 3 minutes under canopy. It's a big cliff. After all that we still had to escape farmer nasty's land and the back of my neck got nailed going under an electric fence farmer Nasty had. It was a wonderful jump.


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