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Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland)
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Mikki_ZH

Oct 16, 2014, 6:31 AM
Post #1 of 31 (16003 views)
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Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) Can't Post

Tom, can you make this a sticky for some time and then ad it to the Lauterbrunnen guidlines after some time?

The police of Lauterbrunnen (the same ones that will have to identify your smashed up body if you go in in Lauterbrunnen) informed me that repeatedly jumpers have landed on the main road at Stechelberg. Today an accident has only been avoided by luck because an english speaking BASE Tourist has landed on the main road in Front of the Hotel Stechelberg in front of a driving car.
Believe me; it is very annoying to have to write this kind of information. This is common sense and I should not have to tell this to anybody. We are grownups and I’m not a Kindergarden teacher!
This year was a mess, reckless behavior, landings in the middle of Lauterbrunnen, jumping the Staubbach, littering at the exits, landing on the main road and so on.
The SBA tried to establish a good going along between jumpers and Lauterbrunnen during the last couple of years. Now, thanks to this year we fell down from being welcome to being tolerated. The next step would be falling from being tolerated to not being tolerated in Lauterbrunnen. Lauterbrunnen can do this very easy by simply not transporting jumpers anymore.
We all know that base jumpers don’t like to follow rules. But by not following this very small numbers of rules and use your common sense, the only ones you are hurting is yourself and the jumpers who would like to visit Lauterbrunnen after you.

dan_inagap

Oct 16, 2014, 11:12 AM
Post #2 of 31 (15821 views)
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Re: [Mikki_ZH] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

I think its time to start a name and shame thread Mad

Heat

Oct 16, 2014, 11:59 AM
Post #3 of 31 (15780 views)
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Re: [dan_inagap] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

Sounds appropriate. It's a shame if Lauterbrunnen get's shut down and it is distispectful towards Michi and the orhers in SBA who've worked hard to keep it open.
People fucking suck sometimes...

bluhdow

Oct 16, 2014, 12:25 PM
Post #4 of 31 (15757 views)
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Re: [Heat] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

I honestly think the best solution is as follows:

1. Put a time limit on landing cards and/or limit the number that are issued at any one time.

2. Revoke landing cards from jumpers caught breaking the rules.

3. Enforce major fines/bans for jumpers caught without a landing card.

I feel like we have proved to the people of LB that we are children, and need to be treated as such. People are the worst.

wasatchrider

Oct 16, 2014, 12:38 PM
Post #5 of 31 (15728 views)
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Re: [bluhdow] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

Ive never had anyone check my landing card in the valley.
Limit would just mean more people without still jumping.
Aslo people running in the valley to avoid tickets at a legal location seems kind of silly.
The solution is stop being inconsiderate dicks.

StealthyB

Oct 16, 2014, 1:28 PM
Post #6 of 31 (15693 views)
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Re: [dan_inagap] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

dan_inagap wrote:
I think its time to start a name and shame thread Mad

Sorry to hear about the lack of consideration shown by some who engage in our sport, I agree with Dan, it sucks, but legal BASE sites are fragile environments and we have to protect them as best we can.

I am grateful and appreciate the people like Michi who work so hard to keep these special places available,

Respect, B.

Pendragon

Oct 16, 2014, 2:00 PM
Post #7 of 31 (15655 views)
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Re: [bluhdow] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

bluhdow wrote:
I honestly think the best solution is as follows:

1. Put a time limit on landing cards and/or limit the number that are issued at any one time.

2. Revoke landing cards from jumpers caught breaking the rules.

3. Enforce major fines/bans for jumpers caught without a landing card.

My thoughts on those points:

1. The weather this summer was really bad. I would expect far fewer jumps were made overall than in previous years, yet there were (as a proportion) a greater number of incidents / "events" attracting attention. This suggests the problem is when people only get a limited window of opportunity - and when "there's always tomorrow" doesn't necessarily apply. Coupled with the potential to force jumping "underground", limiting the number of landing cards is definitely not the way forward. A ski-pass style charging system could work (so you pay for a period, and the cost difference between 2 weeks and the whole season is minimal) though.

2&3. Why not revoke the landing cards of irresponsible jumpers and make it compulsory to have one (with maybe a window of grace in order to get one, so an early morning jump is possible following arrival with purchase later in the day)?

3. All jumpers are at the mercy of the train and lift operators to get them to the exit points, or they face long hikes. If they could be convinced to check jumpers (or those that they suspect are jumpers - not difficult to spot) have a pass, this could help - and would give the threat of pass confiscation some teeth.

Ultimately, this is the kind of site that is going to require some form of regulation, whether jumpers at large want it or not - and developing and enacting our own system before one is imposed on us is a far better solution.

bluhdow

Oct 16, 2014, 2:16 PM
Post #8 of 31 (15635 views)
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Re: [Pendragon] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

Maybe the solution lies in transportation then. Local police could start confiscating tram passes and banning jumpers from repurchasing for a period of time.

If you get caught by police landing in tall grass maybe they'll shut down your tram pass for the rest of the day. If you get caught jumping Stubbach they can take it away for the rest of the year.

nickfrey

Oct 16, 2014, 2:43 PM
Post #9 of 31 (15606 views)
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Re: [bluhdow] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

bluhdow wrote:
Maybe the solution lies in transportation then. Local police could start confiscating tram passes and banning jumpers from repurchasing for a period of time.

If you get caught by police landing in tall grass maybe they'll shut down your tram pass for the rest of the day. If you get caught jumping Stubbach they can take it away for the rest of the year.

If it gets to the point that the police or tram/train operators have to get involved in policing our sport, it will be to shut it down.

Stop being dipshits, it's really not hard to follow a few very simple rules and have a little fucking common sense.


(This post was edited by nickfrey on Oct 16, 2014, 2:43 PM)

bluhdow

Oct 16, 2014, 2:54 PM
Post #10 of 31 (15595 views)
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Re: [nickfrey] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

As much as I'd like to think that BASE jumpers can all act like adults and protect/respect one of the only perfect legal sites in the world...I'm starting to lose faith.

434

Oct 16, 2014, 9:15 PM
Post #11 of 31 (15480 views)
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Re: [bluhdow] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

Do not think they are a police state, with an officer at every corner, or in a car two minutes away. A police with nothing else to do than run after naughty base jumpers with an electro chock gun, or a gun at all. Screaming freeze you base jumping motha fucka Tongue. Neither can you expect the local jumpers policing other jumpers voluntary, unless the majority feel the need, and are willing to pay for it.

BigfcknG

Oct 17, 2014, 12:33 AM
Post #12 of 31 (15397 views)
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Re: [Mikki_ZH] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

Time to get vigilante on people, surf style, before the locals finally have enough. 'Self regulated', isn't that what it's called??

http://i.ytimg.com/...q2ZTOU/hqdefault.jpg

Ronald

Oct 17, 2014, 1:52 AM
Post #13 of 31 (15351 views)
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Re: [BigfcknG] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

Irresponsible people should first be educated, and penalized if they continue. As we don't want police to do this, we should do it ourselves. Verbally (e.g. shout), physically (e.g. punch in the xx, open pack jobs,), socially (e.g. tar and feather on BJ, FB, etc.), financially (cut up gear), legaly (landing card refusal). Take your pick. But really, some people just don't listen Mad That is society after all, and that is why we have jails.

StealthyB

Oct 17, 2014, 2:26 AM
Post #14 of 31 (15335 views)
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Re: [nickfrey] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

nickfrey wrote:
Stop being dipshits, it's really not hard to follow a few very simple rules and have a little fucking common sense.

Yes, and with the proliferation of people getting into BASE, maybe those teaching the commercial FJCs could start by reintroducing the concept of BASE Ethics ?

Pre legal BASE access, there was a reason behind the concept of "Burn someone's site,... Risk being Tarred and Feathered. "

B.

matt002

Oct 17, 2014, 3:45 AM
Post #15 of 31 (15292 views)
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Re: [StealthyB] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

BASE will never be a regulated sport, the risk is too high for insurance to ever be viable in such a small market.

I think the end of legal jumping in lauterbrunnen is inevitable. Promoting good ethics may slow this but lauterbrunnen is all convenience and instant gratification, it appeals highly to those who won't listen or talk about ethics but still 'forget' to buy a landing card or phone before jumping.

This may not be such a bad thing, in the long run. Jumpers with commitment and ethics won't leave the sport as a result, but a few of the trash might when jumping involvrsc hiking and logistics again.

Heat

Oct 17, 2014, 8:30 AM
Post #16 of 31 (15151 views)
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Re: [BigfcknG] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

Although I'm all for sharing and avoiding he use of violence (in most cases), aggressive localism certainly has its place and use.

On a different note - asking dipshit people to stop being dipshit is kinda pointless. Call the motherfuckers out with name and number, FORCE the dipshits to clean up their act or have them face the music.

bluhdow

Oct 17, 2014, 9:33 AM
Post #17 of 31 (15104 views)
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Re: [Heat] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

Maybe we can all report offenders (and the offense) to the Horner and they can keep a list. Depending on the offense, they can decide not to give out landing cards (or maybe charge more for a landing card) depending on the offense.

As much as I hate telling people what to do and calling people out like children, LB needs to be protected.

dan_inagap

Oct 17, 2014, 10:35 AM
Post #18 of 31 (15046 views)
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Re: [Ronald] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

I agree 100% Ronald.

This problem requires a communal disciplining method. If you guys name and shame I will not assist those jumpers in South Africa either. If these jumpers risk burning sites there, they have burnt easily accessed sights here!

Time to self regulate before we lose the very freedom we joined the sport for. I'm not above cutting a full line set to make a burners trip here a waste of time.

Edit to add: Obviously don't pack it again... that would be a little harsh. I think post them online where the global community can step in.


(This post was edited by dan_inagap on Oct 17, 2014, 10:37 AM)

Dadsy

Oct 17, 2014, 7:33 PM
Post #19 of 31 (14921 views)
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Re: [StealthyB] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

Why does it always go back to commercial FJC?

I have come through that path, I was in the valley recently, I didnt do anything wrong, its the individual being a dick so blame that individual no one else.

100% on the name and shame thing

OuttaBounZ

Oct 17, 2014, 9:47 PM
Post #20 of 31 (14881 views)
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Re: [Dadsy] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

Dadsy wrote:
Why does it always go back to commercial FJC?

I have come through that path, I was in the valley recently, I didnt do anything wrong, its the individual being a dick so blame that individual no one else.

100% on the name and shame thing



BigfcknG

Oct 17, 2014, 11:19 PM
Post #21 of 31 (14859 views)
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Re: [Dadsy] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

Dadsy wrote:
Why does it always go back to commercial FJC?

Because commercial FJCs give you the basics required to start off, not all the essential tools, so you get people fresh outta an FJC with a GoPro and a name to make and VOILA! Trouble for the rest of us, as evidenced by LB and ITW..... Unsure

OuttaBounZ

Oct 18, 2014, 1:24 AM
Post #22 of 31 (14807 views)
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Re: [BigfcknG] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

And the entire USA...Everyone is a pro with a t-shirt deal and an athlete page now. Laugh

FJC ~> EPICTV

434

Oct 18, 2014, 2:10 AM
Post #23 of 31 (14785 views)
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Re: [BigfcknG] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

Do you think lack of fjc will stop those who is willing to risk their neck, violating others property, the rebels among the rebels?

Lack of Common sense, and Nothing else is what we are talking about. If they havent learned that before they started base, I doubt they ever will.

Places like Kjerag and Lauterbrunnen can only be organized by jumpers onsite, not by internet or written rules. Sorry, it just dont work that way.

How many years have this debate going on, about stupid jumpers in the Walley? All this could have been avoided, if someone who was willing to take their time, and work it like Kjerag.

Mandatory training and information for everyone who is going to jump for the season. 100 euro for the season tag, no matter one day or 365 days. Season tags on their stash bags, helmet tags, or any place that is visable to anyone, so they know they got their "legal" access proved for jumping for the year. It should be a easy tag so lift operators, locals, and other jumpers do not need to ask if they have.

Where else do you find a statistic in base jumping looking like this?


http://www.basekjerag.com/...002B1F9?OpenDocument


(This post was edited by 434 on Oct 18, 2014, 2:35 AM)

kege

Oct 18, 2014, 3:04 AM
Post #24 of 31 (14757 views)
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Re: [434] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

434 wrote:
All this could have been avoided, if someone who was willing to take their time, and work it like Kjerag.

I'm just another jumper with an opinion, but I personally think there's approximately 0% chance that Lauterbrunnen BASE activities could be run like Kjerag. If you've been there, you know why.

On another but related topic, I'm not sure it would be bad for BASE jumping to lose access to LB. Because many bad things in this sport derive from easy access, Disneyland if you will, BASE in that valley. The Swiss being the Swiss though, I don't think they will close it. Maybe restrictions of some sort in the future. Just my opinion, don't get your panties in a bunch. And I love that place. Legal sites in general are good, but there are others that are less of a circus.

Kerkko
BASE1184

Dadsy

Oct 18, 2014, 4:56 AM
Post #25 of 31 (14719 views)
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Re: [BigfcknG] Landing on the street in Lauterbrunnen (or anywhere in Switzerland) [In reply to] Can't Post

and the guy that landed on the road was just out of a FJC?

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